765 Break-In Run

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Guest

Post by Guest » Mon Mar 27, 2006 8:26 am

Not knowing the exact amount but, Didn't the state of Indiana give the Historical Society around $600,00.00? Plus or minus a few thousand $$$

Guest

Post by Guest » Mon Mar 27, 2006 11:25 am

Anonymous wrote:--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Whaaa! If they told everyone who called what they were doing, the place would have been crawling with a ton of people. I remember back in the early '90's when NS wouldn't let you on the property when they serviced 1218. There were alot of pissed off people then, but the NS didn't have to worry about someone getting hurt. What it boils down to, in this case, the fewer who knew, the better. There were only a few people there this morning when the engine left Fort Wayne. There were only a couple of cars that chased it farther than Paulding Road. In the end, you might benefit more from being lied to, because you might get the chance to ride on an excursion. And if you were REALLY into the Society, you would've known what was going to go on.

You can rationalize why it was best for them to lie to me all you want, it changes nothing.

"In the end I might benefit from getting lied to" (???) gimme a break man...you are too funny.

Oh yeah, I'm so amused, maybe I'll just step up and sign over my estate to such honest men. Count on it. :twisted:

nathansixchime
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Break In Secrecy

Post by nathansixchime » Mon Mar 27, 2006 11:41 am

Greg,

I appreciate your judgement and camaraderie. An official press release will be forthcoming to those who are interested.

I must extend our heartfelt thanks to Rail America, the Chicago, Fort Wayne, and Eastern, and Norfolk Southern for making this past weekend possible. Many souls were enlivened, smiles broadened, and friends were made.

For the others,

The CF&E and Rail America specifically requested that we not advertise these break-in runs for the many reasons others have suggested.

Safety was paramount over everything. No one was trying to "hide" the 765 from anyone. Not only did we want to protect the public at large from injury, but ourselves. If something had gone wrong, not only would the public have been witness to it (and immediately run to these forums to post speculation and misinformation) but they could just as easily have been injured or worse. This includes chasers (as there was an accident on Lincoln Highway before we even got on the mainline shortly before NS picked us up Saturday!) However, this is not to say we are all accident prone or lawsuits waiting to happen, but nevertheless the railroads asked us not to advertise to anyone and we complied. Originally, many of our mechanical crew were not going to be allowed aboard the train themselves. This is how serious the concern for safety and operation puncuality was.

I do apologize for whomever called the shop to verify if the Berkshire was running and was "lied to." Since you do not provide your Society membership number or name, I cannot apologize to you personally.

It was advised sometime Friday to not answer the phone at all because people were calling wanting to know about the engine. When emailed and called about the run, I responded "There are no public excursions this weekend" or did not respond at all.

The bottom line here is that we recieve our income for the locomotive from operating excursions. We cannot have these excursions unless we form a relationship with hosting railroads and do our best to meet their requests. The 765 ran a test run, and not a public excursion, and while it was difficult to not let the world know about our magnificent machine's return to the high iron and to invite everyone to enjoy the fruits of our thirteen year labor, we had to go the route of secrecy.

If you want to see the locomotive or know more about future operations you are encouraged to purchase a ticket for excursions or work down at our shop.

We will look forward to seeing you.

Kelly Lynch
Last edited by nathansixchime on Mon Mar 27, 2006 3:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Kelly Lynch
Vice President
Fort Wayne Railroad Historical Society
http://www.fortwaynerailroad.org

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Bob Durnell
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Post by Bob Durnell » Mon Mar 27, 2006 3:02 pm

Kelly, thanks for taking the time to give us the FWRHS side of the story. While I admit to being a little disappointed about the whole deal originally, I fully understand why it had to be that way. To try to operate an excursion steam engine on somebody elses rails in the 21st century is a daunting task. I know the FWRHS is the unfortunate "victim" of a lot of circumstances that are way beyond your control such as dealing with "idiot foamers" and insurance demands and restrictions, all while being a gracious guest in a rail industry that is not anywhere close to being as accomodating to steam excursions as they were when you guys started. While it may not always suit my selfish desires, keep doing whatever you have to do to keep 765 under steam and on the rails, instead stuffed and mounted like 611 and 1218. It will be worth it!
If my opinions offend you, you should see the ones I keep to myself........

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Post by KEITH_HARRIS » Mon Mar 27, 2006 8:12 pm

OK JOE, TELL US WHAT IT FELT LIKE IN THE CAB. ALSO DID THEY LET YOU RUN IT ANY.

KEITH

Chaser1

765

Post by Chaser1 » Mon Mar 27, 2006 8:12 pm

Kelly
Thank - you for your side of thing again.....Now for the million dollor ?? will we see her agian this year out running for " PUBLIC " display and photos???

Chad

Guest

Post by Guest » Mon Mar 27, 2006 9:01 pm

The grant was actually from the Government, if I understood correctly. Something called TEA 21. Stands for something like Transportation Education Authority for the 21st century. Was supposed to be a 80/20 deal. Last I had heard, the society had had to raise $87,000 as their 20%.

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Post by Joe Millspaugh » Mon Mar 27, 2006 9:08 pm

Keith....I will give you my side of the story off line in the form of an e-mail directed to you...not something to discuss here...but I will say this much....I ran 110 many times and fired her many more...she was nothing like the Berk...
Joe

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Notch 8
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NKP 765

Post by Notch 8 » Tue Mar 28, 2006 7:26 am

I sat down this morning and read the thread from over the weekend
about 765, I would havw swore there was a bunch of OLD MEN in the
room. it is humorous to read the previous lines... hahahahah!!!!

Anyhow watched Cris Howe's video. Great Job.

I believe that it is in the best interest of all parties to keep certain
aspects of the operations under curtain.

It is neat that Rail America allowed this to happen and my view of
this company was just enhanced ! bet it took more than a phone
call...

What I would like to see is 765 come from the west into Fort Recovery
OH with the train order lit up. Did this engine run on that trackage.

They could paint 765 up like a dash-9 with whiskers and ditch lites
and people would just ignore the thing.. :(

Gotta go back to work !!!

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Post by redside20 » Tue Mar 28, 2006 9:03 am

gee its a shame i didn't get out to see it. What a sight that made

Berry

lied to

Post by Berry » Tue Mar 28, 2006 12:29 pm

Big deal....you were lied to about something that you had no business knowing about anyway. Just consider the facts here....A 60 year old engine operating for the first time after a total rebuild on a railroad with a no-steam policy (NS) and a railroad that has never hosted steam before (CF&E) trying to avoid disrupting normal railroad operations and a high probablility of having mechanical problems. Does that sound like a good time to have people out taking pictures? This isn't a game folks. Railroading is a serious business with no room for delays or errors and a 400 ton steam locomotive is not a toy. If you wan't to photography a berkshire anytime you want, go to a museum. 779 in Lima comes to mind. If you want to see a berkshire hauling heavy tonnage at 60mph on the mainline then step back and let the folks at Ft. Wayne do what they need to do to make it happen. When the time comes to run for the public, I'm sure they will let us know.

Guest

Re: lied to

Post by Guest » Tue Mar 28, 2006 1:53 pm

Berry wrote:Big deal....you were lied to about something that you had no business knowing about anyway. Just consider the facts here.
It is a big deal, and maybe you should consider the fact that your opinion of how I should feel, or not feel, or have a right to feel, is of so little consequence that you make me laugh.

In your opinion it was none of my business, fine. Take that to mr donut and see if it gets you a cup of coffee.

I was going to let this simply drop, seeing that the PR guy from the society has stated that he see's no difference between the supporting members and the public at large.. And I still intend to let it drop.

But making the point that what you might happen to think is my business, matters not, was worth one more post on the subject.

I see a world of difference between a decision to "not advertise to the public at large" versus intentionally distributing misinformation, you wanna disagree? that 's fine. But it is not your position to decide what is my business, and what is not. Sorry if you feel otherwise.

Hey, I fully respect the society's right to do as they wish, it is their toy. But at the same time it seems woefully messed up for those of us who cared enough to contribute, and have waited patiently, looking forward to JUST SUCH A DAY, and then be intentionally played for a fool...

Something just doesn't wash with their assurances of how much they appreciate the support of those who contribute, and then have the "star of the show" hustled out the back door, to avoid the fans. Then the PR guy covers the get away trail with an explanation that, greatly condensed, reflects that the rank and file membership is seen as no different from the general public. Some way to show appreciation

I've had my say, you can now thump your chest all you want to, it won't mean a thing.

I'm through.

nathansixchime
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Just to clear things up

Post by nathansixchime » Tue Mar 28, 2006 2:34 pm

Just to clear some things up:
Hey, I fully respect the society's right to do as they wish, it is their toy. But at the same time it seems woefully messed up for those of us who cared enough to contribute, and have waited patiently, looking forward to JUST SUCH A DAY, and then be intentionally played for a fool...

Something just doesn't wash with their assurances of how much they appreciate the support of those who contribute, and then have the "star of the show" hustled out the back door, to avoid the fans. Then the PR guy covers the get away trail with an explanation that, greatly condensed, reflects that the rank and file membership is seen as no different from the general public. Some way to show appreciation
Even if we had told every member (500+ people), we would have still unofficially advertised the event. When the locomotive is in on the road, it is not safe to have 100 people physically present all of a sudden, especially when the railroads specifically asked that it wanted as few people as possible on their rails, including members.

Every member was given a special invite in October before our open house when the locomotive was steamed up, and every member who works at the shop sees the engine, and every member was invited to a special dinner last winter.

Once again, I offer my apologies to whomever feels they were misled, lied to, or kept in the dark. This was not a member's day or a day to "play choo-choo," it was a serious business endeavor to insure the quality of the work done on the locomotive, gather data and statistics on the locomotive's performance, and establish a working relationship with the railroad. If you involved in any part of that work, you should be proud.

On a personal note...

The railroad preservation community needs to become closer, more understanding, more willing to work together, and more aware of the current railroading climate and the situations it presents. It does no good to point fingers and cry foul among friends who share common interests and common goals. In fact, a volunteer on another locomotive in the midwest was the one who began asking people left and right on the internet about the 765 rumors and I find this irresponsible, especially since the gentlemen did no work whatsoever on the engine and should know the intricacies involved in making any steam locomotive movement on mainline rails.

I could be miffed that some of the members were given throttle time before we left the property and that I missed out, or that someone got to blow the whistle and it wasn't me, but I understand that as long as I'm involved, as long as I'm trying to benefit the locomotive, the society, and our members, I'm a part of the action, and am trying to at least appear helpful, and that maybe someday my hand will sing a song on a Nathan six chime.

When the Ohio Central test ran the LS&I 33 last fall, I was not sent an invitation, nor did I beg my friends for facts about its running date. Surely, I had been a paid employee and a volunteer who had worked on the locomotive for a tedious, tiresome summer, and had nearly lost a limb or two hoisting thermic syphons into her belly, and surely I had become extremely good friends with the locomotive's former owner (having suffered with him in 33's tender on a sticky July day) but knowing that because a piece of my time and dime was involved and that the engine ran at all was satisfying enough.

Anyone who may still question the test run, I encourage you to email me or call me personally.

Very truly,

Kelly Lynch
Kelly Lynch
Vice President
Fort Wayne Railroad Historical Society
http://www.fortwaynerailroad.org

Berry

Post by Berry » Tue Mar 28, 2006 3:42 pm

Well stated Mr. Lynch. I should probably let this drop, but I have a strong fear that the attitude of people like "guest" will eventually spell the end of mainline excursions. If CF&E and NS strickly stated that this was to be kept secret (which I don't doubt given liablility concerns today), then how does it look when people start showing up on private railroad property to get pictures? I'm sure FWRHS jumped through many hurdles to get the cooperation of two railroads (one of which treats steam like the plague) to operate their unproven locomotive on mainline trackage. I sure hope the insensitivity of a few don't ruin future chances.

What "guest" and others need to realize that being a member who supports financially and part of the operating crew are two totally diffent categories. Mr Lynch says the have about 500 members. Over on the 765 website there is a crew photograph of about a dozen men and women. These are the people who sweated away the past 13 years restoring 765 and they are the ones who have the knowledge to operate her. I suspect these are the ones that were there this weekend leaving some 400 or so people in the dark. When the time comes for 765 to run for the public, her fans, and her supporters, I'm sure they will tell us. In the meantime we all need to step back and give the crew some space in getting this thing ready for service. The fact that they have been successful in putting a big steamer back into operation and getting it track time on major railroads is nothing short of a miracle in this day in age and public excursions are the next step which is now probably within easy reach given their rebuilding success, break-in success and relationships they are obviously forming with the railroads. Please don't screw it up now with pure selfishness.

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Engine Turn

Post by Steve Bryan » Wed Mar 29, 2006 5:43 pm

Saturday morning when 765 left Casad, it was facing west. When it arrived at the hump, it was facing east. Where did it get turned?

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